Curse

enxa · Apr 10, 2008, 09:08 AM // 09:08

I find it apsurd that some players prefer a N/Rt speccing in Restoration Magic over a Rt/any, because of the energy management. Sure a Rt primary with a resto rune heals for more, but this doesnt seem to matter, as N/Rt's can spam heal spells better.
IMO, a primary Rt should be better at healing than a secondary, just as a primary Monk is.

So i propose a buff to Spawning Power to increase the desirability of resto ritu's.

Something along the lines of "For every 3 ranks in Spawning Power, your Restoration Magic spells cost 1 less energy to cast (minimum 2 energy)".

The minimum being there to prevent spells costing no energy at 15 SP, or at lower SP combined with Attuned was Songkai.

The minimum could also be 3e. 1e would be too overpowered, while 4e would not be ufefull at all.

What do you tnink?

itsme · Apr 10, 2008, 09:38 AM // 09:38

I'd rather prefer something similar to the divine favor bonus.
e.g. for x points in spawning power you get z bonus healing / weapon spells last q% longer / created entities last y% longer ...

because that line of yours just promotes mindless skill spamming as the N/rt healer does.

jonnieboi05 · Apr 10, 2008, 09:47 AM // 09:47

wha..? N/Rt's aren't neccessarily mindless. a r3 team w/ r9+ n/rt's would roll a r3 team with r3 n/rt's any day. skill in a proffession/build makes a HUGE difference.

on the note of the spawning buff, nah, i would personally say keep it how it is. all a n/rt is is just an ingenious idea to use soul reaping to form an entirely new and profitable healer.

~LeNa~

enxa · Apr 10, 2008, 09:58 AM // 09:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05

on the note of the spawning buff, nah, i would personally say keep it how it is. all a n/rt is is just an ingenious idea to use soul reaping to form an entirely new and profitable healer.

I actually agree, it is a creative way to use soul reaping.
But this wouldnt necessarily nerf it. It would stay as effective. It would just make ritu's a bit more desirable. And when there arent any ritu's arround, a N/Rt would still be ok.

legion_rat · Apr 10, 2008, 11:50 AM // 11:50

I tend to agree with Itsme. But I dont think it should just be restorartion. If your spawning is higher also increase the damage of channeling and communing. Not huge jumps but something big enough to make it fun to be a rit. Or make spirit casting time faster for higher SP.

Good idea to improve sp. I dont mind a necro healer, its a cool idea, but I think that a rit or monk should be able to do it better, its their job.

~the rat~

MithranArkanere · Apr 10, 2008, 01:08 PM // 13:08

I think that primary attributes should be useful work for most or at least half of the professions. Divine Favor and Spawning power are out of this.

Spawning power should have an unique 'spiritual' power... like... having a bit of eaxtra armor while under the effect of an spirit, or slightly reduced duration of hexes and all conditions but burning...
Whatever it is, it should work for at least 5 professions.

enxa · Apr 10, 2008, 02:09 PM // 14:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by legion_rat

I tend to agree with Itsme. But I dont think it should just be restorartion. If your spawning is higher also increase the damage of channeling and communing. Not huge jumps but something big enough to make it fun to be a rit. Or make spirit casting time faster for higher SP.

Good idea to improve sp. I dont mind a necro healer, its a cool idea, but I think that a rit or monk should be able to do it better, its their job.

~the rat~

Channeling and communing dont need a buff, IMO. Channeling is already capable of big spikes, while communing could use certain skill buffs (like Shelter loosing less health when it prevents damage) but overall its ok.

Spawning could use a buff, but adding something simmilar to Divine Favor may not be that effective, nor needed. Spirit Light already heals for 156 at 12 Restoration Magic, 188 at 16, imagine adding something like 30 bonus health to that from a SP bonus. Thats just ridiculous.

Painbringer · Apr 10, 2008, 03:20 PM // 15:20

How about in range of a spirit this ability kicks in?

You can't see me · Apr 10, 2008, 03:56 PM // 15:56

I'm going to disagree with this idea. If Spawning Power gets the needed buff, I'd like to see it benefit all the Ritualist's uses and not just a select few builds and one attribute line.

N1ghtstalker · Apr 10, 2008, 04:22 PM // 16:22

/signed
spawning power is now only usefull in life of spirits and duration of weaponspells
but nothing rly boosts the healing

Racthoh · Apr 10, 2008, 04:31 PM // 16:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by You can't see me

If Spawning Power gets the needed buff, I'd like to see it benefit all the Ritualist's uses and not just a select few builds and one attribute line.

Agreed, however part of the problem is that Ritualist have two unique aspects. Their pots, and the weapon spells. Spirits to a lesser extent as rangers had them first. Each of those aspects needs to be affected by spawning power to make it 'fair' for all buids.

Concerning the pots I think it would be safe for spawning power to provide 1 energy and 5 health per rank while holding an item. Think about it this way; when you're holding an item you lose the benefits of your weapon and offhand. As a caster this means 12 energy from your focus and upwards of 60 health. In addition there are the benefits of HCR and HRT mods. With this change @12 spawning power you're getting back that 12 energy and 60 health that you would lose.

Spirits should cast faster with each rank. They're just too slow, and can be killed faster than it takes to drop them.

Weapon Spells are a little tricky. Perhaps an 4% energy return when they expire per rank. They really can't compete with Soul Reaping returns as it stands.

The Meth · Apr 10, 2008, 04:40 PM // 16:40

I think its fine as it is. A n/rt only beats a primary rit in spamming high energy healing skills, and it takes 12 restoration 12 soul reaping to do that, where as a ritualist only needs 14 restoration. That same ritualist can put 12 in channeling and take advantage of the awesome skills in that line. Ritualists aren't meant to be 100% heal spammers, they are meant to be a combination of damage, support and healing. It's no surprise that another profession can beat them at pure heal-spam.

Ritualists are just fine as they are now without giving them expertise or leadership-style energy gains on their primary attribute.

hurric · Apr 10, 2008, 05:21 PM // 17:21

that's the problem. The n/rt can put 8 in soul reaping (+1 rune) and divide the rest in Restoration and channeling and still achieve the same effect with better e-management.

The Meth · Apr 10, 2008, 05:56 PM // 17:56

The N/rt has between 15% (spirit light) and 25!% (ancestors rage) less effectiveness per spell. Soul reaping can also be rather unreliable in harder times when you are having trouble getting kills consistently at the right times. Ritualists can use spirit channeling to get quite a bit of energy anyway and this energy is consistent.

Necros may be able to have near maximum energy nearly the whole fight, but they don't actually get to use their channeling abilities more often to make up for the lack of damage on each cast. 25% less damage on ancestors rage is a lot.

I like Racthoh's idea about bonuses while holding items and spirits casting faster. The energy gain return from weapon spells I am not too sure about, the last thing we need is another class (the first being paragon) which is based around spamming unremovable buffs everywhere.

street peddler · Apr 10, 2008, 06:17 PM // 18:17

at the very least they could just buff the health bonus to 5 or 6%. Maybe even give the spirit an armor bonus too, say, 3% additional armor with each rank.

JASON626 · Apr 10, 2008, 06:42 PM // 18:42

I'd like to see something added as well. Spawning has uses but normally falls short compared to other professions unique attribute. Chanelling and restoration are the popular uses then communing. But if spawning is made to help with energy it kinda repeats everything, energy storage, expertise, soul reaping, leadership those all help with energy already. Would like to see a more original buff personally.

Sniper22 · Apr 10, 2008, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Lets also move all the spawning power skills and minion hp boost from the rit to the necro because rits shouldn't be able to make good minion bombers like necros.

Necros should also have an decrease cost in blood skills because a r/n toucher shouldnt be better than n/r.

Eles should also have a elemental dmg boost to go with their primary attribute because me/e shouldn't be able to be good fast cast daggers.

/sarcasm

Captain Bulldozer · Apr 10, 2008, 07:01 PM // 19:01

I find it interesting how no one has pointed out that Necros and rits seem to have interchanged some of their primary uses here....

For example, one of the better (or at least more sought after) uses of a Necro in most PvE areas is that of an MM. However, with spawning power's unique abilities, we quite frequently have that Rits can make better MMs. Also, while the rit was designed to occasionally heal, we find that the Necro/Rit can now be a very powerful healer by using Soul reaping.

I think it's a fair point that the primary attributes here have blurred the line between Necro and rit... But I guess I don't see any real problem with the way it is now. Rits are more or less my favorite class in the game, so I'm not in a big hurry to see questionable changes made to their skill/attribute lines.

Tyla · Apr 10, 2008, 09:35 PM // 21:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05

wha..? N/Rt's aren't neccessarily mindless. a r3 team w/ r9+ n/rt's would roll a r3 team with r3 n/rt's any day. skill in a proffession/build makes a HUGE difference.

on the note of the spawning buff, nah, i would personally say keep it how it is. all a n/rt is is just an ingenious idea to use soul reaping to form an entirely new and profitable healer.

~LeNa~

It's mostly on behalf of the entire team's experience.
How much I hate Sway, it depends on both the Monking (Or whatever you want to call it), the melee and the trappers.

But anyone marginly decent would go with a Monk. Prots are reason enough.

However, I like this. Spawning Power in it's current state is absolute junk.
I really think this should be moved into the Ritualist forum, mainly.

Div · Apr 10, 2008, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Rits using restoration is perfectly fine. Just look at the Rit runner template in GvG. The only problem with N/Rt's is that soul reaping is still too broken.